mass rdm

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Blue. said:

. I understand its part of the hacker ability but thats an ability to be used with caution

so what would be the intended use of a 10 hack power explosive money pot?

 

 

4 hours ago, Blue. said:

staff member made it out that this was ok then I do not believe a demotion

was weeks ago, we were still on Christmas map i was spectating a user around PD and watched a hacker do what i was doing. mentioned to spectate it in staff chat someone else watched and said they think its allowed due to it being a function of the hacking tool. id give you names but i don't remember who told me, honestly i should have asked for clarification on that before doing it myself.


And goatnuts has a completely fair point no hard feelings if i get demoted, what i did was dumb and even if using the hacker tool to blow a moneypot is RP friendly i prob should have done it in a more RP manor than just dropping it. possibly set it up and leave bait infront of it not just plop it down in the road but was going off what i had seen and again assumed was an acceptable use. we have jobs that are made to kill in mass, terrorist, abomination, angry pig, SK, i felt certain aspects of hacker had the same intention due to the fact they are made to kill/maim.

[Kio]

10 hours ago, GoatNuts said:

Hello, This is a report against a moderator by the way, someone who has to set a standard of abiding rules, if any user were to do this ingame they would be banned for a whole week, and the reported staff member knew EXACTLY what he was doing, The last time i was a staff member i got banned for a week AND got demoted for inciting a player to mass rdm with a sbc cannon, and i do believe we should keep things fair in this server

 

If i were a staff member i would +1 this for demotion & week ban

This situation is way different thn yours, Now I understand what you're saying completely but we gave you chances like the one we're giving Insurance right now. 

and no, If a player thought this was allowed because a staff member said so I don't believe they would receive a 1 week ban but a warning instead. It's different from picking up an SBC (that you know 100% that it'll kill multiple people) and giving it to another player for them to kill multiple people (your staff btw wtf lol)  thn from a ingame job mechanic that he thought was allowed (and told) 

 

AND Insurance isn't the only one that does/did this.... I've seen multiple people do this Mr GoatNuts... But no one had a problem with it up until now so i see why insurance thought it was okay. 

 

I stand by my original answer.

Edited January 17, 2023 by Kio
Grammar

[Guest]

12 hours ago, Kio said:

This situation is way different thn yours, Now I understand what you're saying completely but we gave you chances like the one we're giving Insurance right now. 

and no, If a player thought this was allowed because a staff member said so I don't believe they would receive a 1 week ban but a warning instead. It's different from picking up an SBC (that you know 100% that it'll kill multiple people) and giving it to another player for them to kill multiple people (your staff btw wtf lol)  thn from a ingame job mechanic that he thought was allowed (and told) 

 

AND Insurance isn't the only one that does/did this.... I've seen multiple people do this Mr GoatNuts... But no one had a problem with it up until now so i see why insurance thought it was okay. 

 

I stand by my original answer.

 

How much different it really is?

What i see is a moderator mass rdming, just like i did before

 

Also you can't just accidentally spawn a drug processor, rightclick it a bunch of times to select the right hack and press left click on it, it sounds like something he intended to do to me, and even if it an ingame job mechanic, could you even imagine how mingy, annoying and chaotic would it be to have a bunch of hackers blowing up drug processors all around fountain, killing everone nearby?

 

When i used to do this exact same thing, i KNEW i was doing something wrong and i wouldn't been surprised if i was given a week out, this is why i mostly did it to my friends, who mainly did not have any issue with it, and even enjoyed it

 

If a superior did tell him that this is allowed i would be alright, but just imagine the chaos if this was allowed

[Smelly]

Serious question, why is using your hack phone to blow people up with a money pot or harvest proc or whatever that takes 10 hack points MRDM? You’re limited by the time it takes to restore the points so it isn’t like you’re killing tons of people. Don’t think that should be MRD/RDM by any means

[Rubik]

9 hours ago, Smelly said:

Serious question, why is using your hack phone to blow people up with a money pot or harvest proc or whatever that takes 10 hack points MRDM? You’re limited by the time it takes to restore the points so it isn’t like you’re killing tons of people. Don’t think that should be MRD/RDM by any means

Exactly my point. This is the intended purpose of the swep so I definitely wouldn't consider it mass rdm in most cases. Loopholing? In this video based on the way he spawned it himself, ON someone, and then immediately blew it up it definitely looks like loopholing with the intent to rdm. 

[koda]

On 1/17/2023 at 6:57 AM, Rubik said:

In most cases this is not mass rdm because he’s using a game mechanic for its intended purpose. Same way that spawning a train on someone is not considered mass rdm. In this case though, it seems like he is intentionally spawning the box in order to mass rdm which would fall under the “loopholing” rule separately. 
 

“DO NOT attempt to loophole any rules. Just because something isn’t written down, doesn’t make it okay. The staff has the final say in sits, if you disagree then you should appeal the decision on the forums, not in-game.”

 

What you bring to the table about the whole loopholing thing makes sense but it gets thrown out as soon as you mention train grenades. A hacker has the ability of making money pots explode to RDM. A person with a train grenade / enough cereal to spawn a train can cause RDM aswell. In this case, I think it is unfair to differentiate the two as separate when it seems the creator of both mechanics had the intention of letting said mechanics kill people. The only thing I see different about these is the fact that the train grenade costs more money to do and it can take a while before it even explodes after making everyone in its vicinity aware. If that's the problem, that's not a player problem. That mechanic should have some sort of extra restriction. It already takes a bit for your points to rack up to use it but it would make sense if:

• You couldn't destroy the same players money pot over and over again. Maybe make some sort of cooldown that is player specific.
• You couldn't destroy your own money pot. (And if you did it would blow you up becuz why not)
• It had some sort of explosion warning (like sparks and fire) to it like trains have but make the delay rely on the radius. If people don't understand what is happening, they will after it explodes.

I really do not think it is fair to bring up the loopholing card in this case. Would it make any difference if he were to throw a train grenade (that would kill people on explosion BEFORE the train spawns)? When a hacker destroys some other dudes money pot since its an option and it kills some people, are they held responsible? Where is it crossing the line in general?

 

I would strongly question if it was a valid excusable instance of RDM sure but loopholing shouldn't be in the question. If it is then we should consider train grenades as loopholing too.

[Hoopajoop]

3 hours ago, koda said:

What you bring to the table about the whole loopholing thing makes sense but it gets thrown out as soon as you mention train grenades. A hacker has the ability of making money pots explode to RDM. A person with a train grenade / enough cereal to spawn a train can cause RDM aswell. In this case, I think it is unfair to differentiate the two as separate when it seems the creator of both mechanics had the intention of letting said mechanics kill people. The only thing I see different about these is the fact that the train grenade costs more money to do and it can take a while before it even explodes after making everyone in its vicinity aware. If that's the problem, that's not a player problem. That mechanic should have some sort of extra restriction. It already takes a bit for your points to rack up to use it but it would make sense if:

• You couldn't destroy the same players money pot over and over again. Maybe make some sort of cooldown that is player specific.
• You couldn't destroy your own money pot. (And if you did it would blow you up becuz why not)
• It had some sort of explosion warning (like sparks and fire) to it like trains have but make the delay rely on the radius. If people don't understand what is happening, they will after it explodes.

I really do not think it is fair to bring up the loopholing card in this case. Would it make any difference if he were to throw a train grenade (that would kill people on explosion BEFORE the train spawns)? When a hacker destroys some other dudes money pot since its an option and it kills some people, are they held responsible? Where is it crossing the line in general?

 

I would strongly question if it was a valid excusable instance of RDM sure but loopholing shouldn't be in the question. If it is then we should consider train grenades as loopholing too.

Can you explain exactly why spawning a large and visible entity that loudly exclaims "COME ON MOTHERFUCKERS COME ON" for thirty seconds before exploding and killing everybody that does not mind being killed, and slapping down a money pot in the middle of a group and blowing it up near instantly shouldn't be differentiated?

 

To say the two are basically the same thing feels a little disingenuous, tbh.

 

A better comparison would be spawning a printer, shooting it, and shoving the flaming soon-to-explode-ent into someone's face-- which as far as I'm aware also isn't allowed.

Edited January 23, 2023 by Hoopajoop

[koda]

9 hours ago, Hoopajoop said:

Can you explain exactly why spawning a large and visible entity that loudly exclaims "COME ON MOTHERFUCKERS COME ON" for thirty seconds before exploding and killing everybody that does not mind being killed, and slapping down a money pot in the middle of a group and blowing it up near instantly shouldn't be differentiated?

 

To say the two are basically the same thing feels a little disingenuous, tbh.

 

A better comparison would be spawning a printer, shooting it, and shoving the flaming soon-to-explode-ent into someone's face-- which as far as I'm aware also isn't allowed.

 

They are both 2 entities that explode and deal damage to players around it. I didn't say that it shouldn't be considered for RDM.

13 hours ago, koda said:

I would strongly question if it was a valid excusable instance of RDM sure but loopholing shouldn't be in the question.

If you want to make that comparison, do you consider a printer being shoved in someones face as its exploding "loopholing"? What about a C4 being put down and thrown into crowd of people? They are all game mechanics meant to damage players, 

 

If we want to get technical, why aren't people who spawn trains using train grenades at fountain/etc being banned for MRDM since there isn't any written rule defending it iirc, is it because the train doesn't immediately explode? With that logic, I could announce to everyone near me in VC or /yell that I'm about to blow them up with an SBC cannon in 30 seconds and do it.

 

What should be done is having stuff like this written in the rules so it doesn't happen again. I believe that @Insurance Agent was incredibly stupid for doing this without asking before doing so but I believe he shouldn't be demoted/banned., at most I would say he should be retrained if this was that much of a serious issue.

[Blue.]

This will be accepted and Insurance Agent will be warned/striked for this situation