Special Educator Ban Appeal

[Memes]

Your Steam Name: Memes

 

Your in-game name: Special Educator

 

Your SteamID: STEAM_1:0:80009642

 

Why were you warned/banned?: Raiding With Train

 

Why should you be unwarned/unbanned? : I was not "raiding with train." I decided I would actively go for the cereal spent on wishes leaderboard, since I had a bunch of cereal saved up. As such, I decided to cause a little mayhem, and chose to use the train. I was checking the list and settled on ToeSlurper as a target. Unfortunately for him, and me as it would turn out, he was apparently inside of his base at the time. And so the train went boom, and so did he. A report was filed immediately, and I found myself in sit land. However, the claim against me is that I actively was using the train to get an upper hand in a raid against Toe's base, which is simply not true. I was directed to a rule change and it clearly states that if a train is placed into a base (in this case I hadn't even thought twice about whether it'd go into a base or not) but should a train find its way into a base, you CAN NOT under any circumstances use that an a gateway to raid the base fully. "You are not allowed to continue to perform other raiding actions such as chucking C4 into their base or lockpicking, you cannot raid the base again before the normal time limit, and you cannot switch jobs in order to raid them after summoning the train." I did none of these things. I carried on my day and was on my way to look for more cereal when I was sent to sit land. I didn't summon the train for raiding purposes, and I specifically asked Equinox if he had any evidence of me performing any raiding actions after the train was summoned and he could not.

 

The only "log" he could show me, no offense meant for him at all you just have to see it from my perspective, was a lockpicking that I apparently did roughly 3 minutes before summoning the train, and he didnt even verify whether the door was to their base or not because I didn't lockpick their base at all tonight. However, when I went through my own personal logs, I noticed that the "log" he showed me didnt match at all to what mine showed, which leads me to suspect he may have just made it up on the spot, again you have to see it from my point of view. I'll explain:

He pasted the log - "01:37:38 Player Special Educator (Bang Bros) lockpicked Entity [1220][prop_door_rotating]" - Now I understand the hour would be based off of individual time zones. However, I can only assume the minutes would be the same. Which means that according to his set of "logs" I was Bang Bros CC at around the 37:38 minute mark. However, I checked my version of logs and it states that i was Picolas Cage at the 37:39 mark. "Player 22Enigmas (Juggernaut) killed Special Educator (Picolas Cage) with weapon tfcss_minigun" which means that either 1) the logs are not as accurate as I originally thought. 2) Equinox was mistaken with his time and didnt actually copy paste it.

 

TLDR: My point I'm trying to make is that I had no intentions of raiding their base and I wasn't using the train as an improvised c4 in order to get an advantage in a raid. I simply chose Toe without thinking and he happened to be home. I didn't rush to his base and start chucking c4, or picking into it, nothing.

 

 

Who warned/banned you and for how long?: Equinox | 5 days

 

Evidence: 

 

Two images showing the logs from my point of view, to try and explain that I did not raiding actions after summoning the train.https://imgur.com/a/OTQ8jCH

 

Also: odds are I might fall asleep after posting this I apologize if I do but I doubt this will get any feedback this late at night anyway. <3 Thank you for reading

[Quas]

I have never been a fan of you, but off of what im hearing and seeing, this was a false ban. The reason that the "Train Raiding" rule was implemented was because placing a train on someone when they are basing purposely, and changing to a raiding class and conducting a raid gave an unfair advantage (mostly because the raider could just wait for the based players to remove the dupe and continue a raid). Lockpicking a base, then switching to picolas cage and placing a train on someone with no further action, is not against the rules. (its a bit of a scummy move, but not against the rules). It just seems like the banning staff member (Equinox) was just trying to find anyway to give you a ban, which i dont think is very fair. The only possible way i could see you getting in trouble for this is a warn for not waiting raid timer (that is REALLY pushing it though). I know im just a t-mod, but i am +1 for unban, because of the reasons stated.

[plutori]

The rule in question specifically states that summoning a train is considered a raid. Although I agree that the spirit of the rule is that you should not use the train to assist you in a raid, ie train > switch jobs -> continue raid, the hard written language of the rule is that if you raid someone and then immediately go to the pickle statue and summon a train on them, you will be in violation of breaking raid cooldown timer.

 

Now, that being said, no idea what's going on with the logs in this situation - however, I talked to one of the players who was in the base at the time, and they said you failed to raid them and then trained them. Additionally, we have equinox, one of my staff members, saying you lockpicked them as well, with a log provided. Pretty pissed off that you're implying one of my staff members falsified a log, especially when the log you posted doesn't even have a timestamp attached to it, just your word. That's in the screenshots, oops!

 

This is probably due to users having different logs system than staff. In your own screenshot it even says some things may not be accurate, at the bottom of the screenshot. Still pretty mad you're implying one of my staff would falsify a log when the system clearly tells you your logs are not accurate.

[Memes]

I apologize for any offence you may have taken, as I said in my appeal I didn't mean to make any hardcore accusations. I was mainly just trying to point out that I am 99% sure I didn't lockpick that base because I raided another base in the sewer and Equinox was using that log as his evidence that I used the train on Toe's base and then proceeded to raid it, which seems to be the entire basis of my ban. It also went over my head and I wasn't thinking about the fact that it may not be accurate, but the logs were essentially my only evidence since I wasn't recording at the time.

 

Also DaddyClap, the thing that made me suspicious (but definitely could just be inaccurate log times) if you check it, it says I was Bang Bros when I was lockpicking and then 1 second later I was Picolas, which would imply I lockpicked, changed jobs and then got shot all at once, which I didn't do. But again it ocurs to me now that the times could be way off.

 

And hamborgor, thats exactly what happened. I did a train on him and then stayed as Picolas and never did anything that would constitute a raid, I was even still Picolas when I was brought up to sit land.

[toeslurper24]

Being that I was the person who was trained and the person who called the sit, this is all I have to say on this matter. https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/773972910609221890/F7CB43BF24CC09940A27B07DA0E778E1779E8266/ this is a screenshot from the sit.

 

Edit: Removed a strange "!" mark

[VIZLA]

There is a lot of points that I wish to make here, first I would like to include the video of Special Educator using the train on our base, as well as a screenshot of the Picolas Cage Class stating that you can't raid, as well as a screenshot of the Stupid Job rule stating that "Spawning a train on a base is considered a raid", all evidence is shown below.

 

 

In the MOTD under stupid job rules it states this:

If Picolas Cage summons a train on a player outside of a base, it is considered a natural event (and therefore is not Mass RDM when 80 players crowd around your train for the memes). If a train is summoned inside of a base, that is considered as a raid. Since Picolas Cage is a job defined to not be permitted to raid, this means you are not allowed to continue to perform other raiding actions such as chucking C4 into their base or lockpicking, you cannot raid the base again before the normal time limit, and you cannot switch jobs in order to raid them after summoning the train. To make it simple - no summoning a train for raiding purposes.

 

 

Lolita had came to the base not 5 minutes prior to look into the base, he then saw who was inside of the base as example of him telling Finnagin that he "broke NLR", when he was standing outside of the base. He then figured out who was inside of the base due to ownership of doors and party, then switched jobs to train the base. It's all evident in the logs, in the video, in the MOTD. You had malintent, as well as claiming "you're done with the server, I just came back for the 4th of july shit", showing your lack of care for the actions you've done, as well as lack of judgement.

[Quas]

There is a lot of points that I wish to make here, first I would like to include the video of Special Educator using the train on our base, as well as a screenshot of the Picolas Cage Class stating that you can't raid, as well as a screenshot of the Stupid Job rule stating that "Spawning a train on a base is considered a raid", all evidence is shown below.

 

 

In the MOTD under stupid job rules it states this:

If Picolas Cage summons a train on a player outside of a base, it is considered a natural event (and therefore is not Mass RDM when 80 players crowd around your train for the memes). If a train is summoned inside of a base, that is considered as a raid. Since Picolas Cage is a job defined to not be permitted to raid, this means you are not allowed to continue to perform other raiding actions such as chucking C4 into their base or lockpicking, you cannot raid the base again before the normal time limit, and you cannot switch jobs in order to raid them after summoning the train. To make it simple - no summoning a train for raiding purposes.

 

 

Lolita had came to the base not 5 minutes prior to look into the base, he then saw who was inside of the base as example of him telling Finnagin that he "broke NLR", when he was standing outside of the base. He then figured out who was inside of the base due to ownership of doors and party, then switched jobs to train the base. It's all evident in the logs, in the video, in the MOTD. You had malintent, as well as claiming "you're done with the server, I just came back for the 4th of july shit", showing your lack of care for the actions you've done, as well as lack of judgement.

 

 

June 1st, 2019

 

Added Stupid job rule:

 

If Picolas Cage summons a train on a player outside of a base, it is considered a natural event (and therefore is not Mass RDM when 80 players crowd around your train for the memes). If a train is summoned inside of a base, that is considered as a raid. Since Picolas Cage is a job defined to not be permitted to raid, this means you are not allowed to continue to perform other raiding actions such as chucking C4 into their base or lockpicking, you cannot raid the base again before the normal time limit, and you cannot switch jobs in order to raid them after summoning the train. To make it simple - no summoning a train for raiding purposes.

 

Basically, the natural events thing was put into the rules in order to finally make sense of thomas not being considered mass rdm, but players have been abusing this in order to raid players. And we want to fix this.

 

This is the full changelog. As long as no further action was taken after he placed the train, it wasnt against the rules and off of the evidence shown, no further action was taken. I dont agree with people doing this, especially if its on purpose, but it is allowed. Personally I think the train should be tweaked to where it doesnt blow up entities so you cant do this scummy stuff and i feel like that would fix the problem and would reduce the amount of people doing this on purpose. Im still +1 for unban for the reasons stated above.

[VIZLA]

There is a lot of points that I wish to make here, first I would like to include the video of Special Educator using the train on our base, as well as a screenshot of the Picolas Cage Class stating that you can't raid, as well as a screenshot of the Stupid Job rule stating that "Spawning a train on a base is considered a raid", all evidence is shown below.

 

 

In the MOTD under stupid job rules it states this:

If Picolas Cage summons a train on a player outside of a base, it is considered a natural event (and therefore is not Mass RDM when 80 players crowd around your train for the memes). If a train is summoned inside of a base, that is considered as a raid. Since Picolas Cage is a job defined to not be permitted to raid, this means you are not allowed to continue to perform other raiding actions such as chucking C4 into their base or lockpicking, you cannot raid the base again before the normal time limit, and you cannot switch jobs in order to raid them after summoning the train. To make it simple - no summoning a train for raiding purposes.

 

 

Lolita had came to the base not 5 minutes prior to look into the base, he then saw who was inside of the base as example of him telling Finnagin that he "broke NLR", when he was standing outside of the base. He then figured out who was inside of the base due to ownership of doors and party, then switched jobs to train the base. It's all evident in the logs, in the video, in the MOTD. You had malintent, as well as claiming "you're done with the server, I just came back for the 4th of july shit", showing your lack of care for the actions you've done, as well as lack of judgement.

 

 

June 1st, 2019

 

Added Stupid job rule:

 

If Picolas Cage summons a train on a player outside of a base, it is considered a natural event (and therefore is not Mass RDM when 80 players crowd around your train for the memes). If a train is summoned inside of a base, that is considered as a raid. Since Picolas Cage is a job defined to not be permitted to raid, this means you are not allowed to continue to perform other raiding actions such as chucking C4 into their base or lockpicking, you cannot raid the base again before the normal time limit, and you cannot switch jobs in order to raid them after summoning the train. To make it simple - no summoning a train for raiding purposes.

 

Basically, the natural events thing was put into the rules in order to finally make sense of thomas not being considered mass rdm, but players have been abusing this in order to raid players. And we want to fix this.

 

This is the full changelog. As long as no further action was taken after he placed the train, it wasnt against the rules and off of the evidence shown, no further action was taken. I dont agree with people doing this, especially if its on purpose, but it is allowed. Personally I think the train should be tweaked to where it doesnt blow up entities so you cant do this scummy stuff and i feel like that would fix the problem and would reduce the amount of people doing this on purpose. Im still +1 for unban for the reasons stated above.

 

 

If a train is summoned inside of a base, that is considered as a raid.

 

That statement on it's own nullifies the entire rest of the statement of it "being continued", he knew there was a base there, he was fully aware of what he had done. It's obvious in the responses and the demeanor of him going to the base to see who was inside not even 5 minutes prior then spawning a train on the base.

[Quas]

There is a lot of points that I wish to make here, first I would like to include the video of Special Educator using the train on our base, as well as a screenshot of the Picolas Cage Class stating that you can't raid, as well as a screenshot of the Stupid Job rule stating that "Spawning a train on a base is considered a raid", all evidence is shown below.

 

 

In the MOTD under stupid job rules it states this:

If Picolas Cage summons a train on a player outside of a base, it is considered a natural event (and therefore is not Mass RDM when 80 players crowd around your train for the memes). If a train is summoned inside of a base, that is considered as a raid. Since Picolas Cage is a job defined to not be permitted to raid, this means you are not allowed to continue to perform other raiding actions such as chucking C4 into their base or lockpicking, you cannot raid the base again before the normal time limit, and you cannot switch jobs in order to raid them after summoning the train. To make it simple - no summoning a train for raiding purposes.

 

 

Lolita had came to the base not 5 minutes prior to look into the base, he then saw who was inside of the base as example of him telling Finnagin that he "broke NLR", when he was standing outside of the base. He then figured out who was inside of the base due to ownership of doors and party, then switched jobs to train the base. It's all evident in the logs, in the video, in the MOTD. You had malintent, as well as claiming "you're done with the server, I just came back for the 4th of july shit", showing your lack of care for the actions you've done, as well as lack of judgement.

 

 

June 1st, 2019

 

Added Stupid job rule:

 

If Picolas Cage summons a train on a player outside of a base, it is considered a natural event (and therefore is not Mass RDM when 80 players crowd around your train for the memes). If a train is summoned inside of a base, that is considered as a raid. Since Picolas Cage is a job defined to not be permitted to raid, this means you are not allowed to continue to perform other raiding actions such as chucking C4 into their base or lockpicking, you cannot raid the base again before the normal time limit, and you cannot switch jobs in order to raid them after summoning the train. To make it simple - no summoning a train for raiding purposes.

 

Basically, the natural events thing was put into the rules in order to finally make sense of thomas not being considered mass rdm, but players have been abusing this in order to raid players. And we want to fix this.

 

This is the full changelog. As long as no further action was taken after he placed the train, it wasnt against the rules and off of the evidence shown, no further action was taken. I dont agree with people doing this, especially if its on purpose, but it is allowed. Personally I think the train should be tweaked to where it doesnt blow up entities so you cant do this scummy stuff and i feel like that would fix the problem and would reduce the amount of people doing this on purpose. Im still +1 for unban for the reasons stated above.

If a train is summoned inside of a base, that is considered as a raid.

 

That statement on it's own nullifies the entire rest of the statement of it "being continued", he knew there was a base there, he was fully aware of what he had done. It's obvious in the responses and the demeanor of him going to the base to see who was inside not even 5 minutes prior then spawning a train on the base.

 

Yes placing a train counts as a raid, but the rule says that as long as no further action is taken, it is not against the rules. The very most that Special Educator could get is a warn for FailRP and that is pushing it.

[plutori]

There is a lot of points that I wish to make here, first I would like to include the video of Special Educator using the train on our base, as well as a screenshot of the Picolas Cage Class stating that you can't raid, as well as a screenshot of the Stupid Job rule stating that "Spawning a train on a base is considered a raid", all evidence is shown below.

 

 

In the MOTD under stupid job rules it states this:

If Picolas Cage summons a train on a player outside of a base, it is considered a natural event (and therefore is not Mass RDM when 80 players crowd around your train for the memes). If a train is summoned inside of a base, that is considered as a raid. Since Picolas Cage is a job defined to not be permitted to raid, this means you are not allowed to continue to perform other raiding actions such as chucking C4 into their base or lockpicking, you cannot raid the base again before the normal time limit, and you cannot switch jobs in order to raid them after summoning the train. To make it simple - no summoning a train for raiding purposes.

 

 

Lolita had came to the base not 5 minutes prior to look into the base, he then saw who was inside of the base as example of him telling Finnagin that he "broke NLR", when he was standing outside of the base. He then figured out who was inside of the base due to ownership of doors and party, then switched jobs to train the base. It's all evident in the logs, in the video, in the MOTD. You had malintent, as well as claiming "you're done with the server, I just came back for the 4th of july shit", showing your lack of care for the actions you've done, as well as lack of judgement.

 

 

June 1st, 2019

 

Added Stupid job rule:

 

If Picolas Cage summons a train on a player outside of a base, it is considered a natural event (and therefore is not Mass RDM when 80 players crowd around your train for the memes). If a train is summoned inside of a base, that is considered as a raid. Since Picolas Cage is a job defined to not be permitted to raid, this means you are not allowed to continue to perform other raiding actions such as chucking C4 into their base or lockpicking, you cannot raid the base again before the normal time limit, and you cannot switch jobs in order to raid them after summoning the train. To make it simple - no summoning a train for raiding purposes.

 

Basically, the natural events thing was put into the rules in order to finally make sense of thomas not being considered mass rdm, but players have been abusing this in order to raid players. And we want to fix this.

 

This is the full changelog. As long as no further action was taken after he placed the train, it wasnt against the rules and off of the evidence shown, no further action was taken. I dont agree with people doing this, especially if its on purpose, but it is allowed. Personally I think the train should be tweaked to where it doesnt blow up entities so you cant do this scummy stuff and i feel like that would fix the problem and would reduce the amount of people doing this on purpose. Im still +1 for unban for the reasons stated above.

If a train is summoned inside of a base, that is considered as a raid.

 

That statement on it's own nullifies the entire rest of the statement of it "being continued", he knew there was a base there, he was fully aware of what he had done. It's obvious in the responses and the demeanor of him going to the base to see who was inside not even 5 minutes prior then spawning a train on the base.

 

Yes placing a train counts as a raid, but the rule says that as long as no further action is taken, it is not against the rules. The very most that Special Educator could get is a warn for FailRP and that is pushing it.

 

It can be considered a couple things in this case. Firstly, breaking raid timer, and secondly, arguably harassment (repeating a rule-legal action on the same player, in this case raiding, because they're upset the first raid failed).