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Abstergo

16 Tick and the conversation we need to have around tickrate

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13 minutes ago, ZestyBoi said:

I mostly agree with all of this, 16 tick is so terrible for pvp, even though darkrp is based around rp situations, a good amount of those situations involve fights, they're also usually the most enjoyable.

 

Even an increase from 16 tick to 32 tick would be amazing for pvp, since usually in gun fights, unless the person is standing still / very slow, you're putting your shots to a dice roll. We really need to get a new server host that could withstand 32-64 tick rates, it would make the gun fights based around more skillful play, but it could definitely be pretty demanding, since the server almost always peaks at 100+ players.

I’d even take 22 tick at this point dude. Increased tickrate comes with diminishing returns so I probably wouldn’t go as high as 64, but I think Roblox servers run at a higher tickrate than we do at the moment.

With the way the server is optimised I also think that with just a little cleanup of old code it should be totally viable on a strong enough server.

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Some things I want you to keep in note, you used CS:GO for an example of a game which if I remember correctly it uses like 64 tick on average, this means that EVERYTHING in the game will update between ALL players at 64 ticks per second. CS:GO is able to manage this for a number of reasons that TitsRP may not be able to compare to

 

1.) CS:GO has a vastly more competitive game then funny TitsRP is so a high tickrate is essential

2.) CS:GO, Dota 2, Portal 2 and Left 4 Dead 2 essentially run on what we call source 1.5 as it is an upgraded version than the one that gmod, tf2 and hl2 runs on and one of the things they improved was less demand on serverside tickrate so it's easier to run higher tickrate on these servers

3.) CS:GO is very consistant and has a much lower playercount of just a mere 16

 

While TitsRP could update to a higher tickrate, I don't think it's at all necessary. The thing with ticks you have to release is that it updates for everyone, so if someone across the map who isn't even rendered for you is shooting a really fast legendary the server will have to send that to every single player, not let's hypothetically assume that half the server is shooting a really fast legendary at 16tps and 30tps (64ish tickrate) that's going to bog down your client as it will have to sync to each and every tick the server sends to you. This can make areas like fountain way more laggy.

 

The lower TPS allows us to have a higher playercount, more "silly" sweps like baby thrower reskins (for example the piss swep could NEVER be added if your client has to render piss at 60tr) powerful stuff like legendaries, etc.

 

I am -1 for raising the tickrate personally, keep in mind sugar said the TICKS PER SECOND is 16, not the tickrate which are both very different also for reference keep in mind that TEAM FORTRESS 2 has a tps of 15 which is even LOWER than TitsRP the reason you don't experience as many issues in that game then compared to TitsRP is the hitboxes and hitreg is more consistent 

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We run at 16 tick which is higher than average for DarkRP servers running 128 players. Some servers run 11 and some run 13 but we run 16.

 

Running a 22 tick is not an option at this time and may not be an option ever because its an exponential performance decrease when increasing the tick. The machine we will be moving to will technically provide us with a 6% - 8% performance increase. As with new technology it is theoretically possible to keep pushing the boundaries but we also have to do a lot of magic optimization on our end to get a 22+ tick to be stable for 128 players.

 

11 tick = every .09 seconds the server "ticks" / processes its data

13 tick = every .07 seconds

16 tick = every .0625

22 tick = every .045

32 tick = every .031

64 tick = every .015

 

If we go to a 22 tick, it means every entity that thinks or has some kind of physics updating and general server logic will be running 22 times each second. In theory going from a 16 -> 22 tick should be a 25%-30% increase in CPU but it may be higher than that. We do not have the resources to do that. We do run on almost cutting edge hardware, our new machine isn't really too much different.

 

We'd have to make a lot of changes. Prop limit would probably go down. Remove / really degrade how some SWEPs work to prevent them from being performance intensive, ect. It's not an easy task to do this.

 

Tits After Dark's theme was to be a limit of 60 - 75 players at a 32 tick. With 128 players, I don't see it happening unless a single threaded CPU comes out that is 100% stronger than the CPU we currently use

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1 minute ago, Sugar Tits said:

We run at 16 tick which is higher than average for DarkRP servers running 128 players. Some servers run 11 and some run 13 but we run 16.

 

Running a 22 tick is not an option at this time and may not be an option ever because its an exponential performance decrease when increasing the tick. The machine we will be moving to will technically provide us with a 6% - 8% performance increase. As with new technology it is theoretically possible to keep pushing the boundaries but we also have to do a lot of magic optimization on our end to get a 22+ tick to be stable for 128 players.

 

11 tick = every .09 seconds the server "ticks" / processes its data

13 tick = every .07 seconds

16 tick = every .0625

22 tick = every .045

32 tick = every .031

64 tick = every .015

 

If we go to a 22 tick, it means every entity that thinks or has some kind of physics updating and general server logic will be running 22 times each second. In theory going from a 16 -> 22 tick should be a 25%-30% increase in CPU but it may be higher than that. We do not have the resources to do that. We do run on almost cutting edge hardware, our new machine isn't really too much different.

 

We'd have to make a lot of changes. Prop limit would probably go down. Remove / really degrade how some SWEPs work to prevent them from being performance intensive, ect. It's not an easy task to do this.

 

Tits After Dark's theme was to be a limit of 60 - 75 players at a 32 tick. With 128 players, I don't see it happening.

I appreciate the response a lot. Is there any other possible solution to the hitreg issues other than tickrate then? I see that I may have underestimated the processing power required to run a gmod server with so many addons, but I still can’t shake the thought that something like that should be possible with modern day server CPUs.

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22 minutes ago, mcdonalds wifi said:

I appreciate the response a lot. Is there any other possible solution to the hitreg issues other than tickrate then? I see that I may have underestimated the processing power required to run a gmod server with so many addons, but I still can’t shake the thought that something like that should be possible with modern day server CPUs.

Gmod servers run on a single core. We don't really have an option to utilize 100% of our CPU power for gmod as gmod only allows 1 core and 1 core only for processing power. (theoretically untrue but for now its the easiest way to think about it)

 

Hit reg issues can be solved and while it may not be as expensive of an option to pump the tickrate to 22, there still will be a performance decrease across the board when shooting players + some security risk. That option is allowing players to tell the server who they're attacking aka client side hit registration. You can make the client say "Hey server, I just attacked Player 2, can you verify this for me and deal damage?" In theory, its a good idea. In practice, it might be okay but it leads to a lot of unwanted security holes but we can get pretty darn close to solving them. An addon that does this is https://www.gmodstore.com/market/view/5340

 

We may look into this for the QoL update. I will log it for now

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